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	<title>Comments on: Wednesday&#8217;s Thoughts &#8230;</title>
	<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/</link>
	<description>What's Going On Here?</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 23:36:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Terry</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2492</link>
		<dc:creator>Terry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Dec 2006 04:08:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2492</guid>
		<description>I think Sam was busy lining the "very fabric" of his own wallet.

P.S. Fred, you're not a downer. But I suspect there is a whole â€™nother side to you no one on this blog gets to see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Sam was busy lining the &#8220;very fabric&#8221; of his own wallet.</p>
<p>P.S. Fred, you&#8217;re not a downer. But I suspect there is a whole â€™nother side to you no one on this blog gets to see.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Baumgarten</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2491</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Baumgarten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Dec 2006 04:01:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2491</guid>
		<description>P.S. Since my last was composed before I saw Terry's last: Gentlemen, I did not mean those institutions are free of charge -- it was a lame nonsequitir with a misplaced modifier.  The intent was: "I offer this list free of charge."  Is it really that obscure, or are you only choosing to see it your way?

As for our emergency services, first responders, and small business owners -- well, bravo, Terry -- you sure got me there!  Mea culpa and ten Hail Marys.

Hey, wait, did you say "small business owners"? -- what about Sam Walton?  How come he's not on the list?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>P.S. Since my last was composed before I saw Terry&#8217;s last: Gentlemen, I did not mean those institutions are free of charge &#8212; it was a lame nonsequitir with a misplaced modifier.  The intent was: &#8220;I offer this list free of charge.&#8221;  Is it really that obscure, or are you only choosing to see it your way?</p>
<p>As for our emergency services, first responders, and small business owners &#8212; well, bravo, Terry &#8212; you sure got me there!  Mea culpa and ten Hail Marys.</p>
<p>Hey, wait, did you say &#8220;small business owners&#8221;? &#8212; what about Sam Walton?  How come he&#8217;s not on the list?</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Baumgarten</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2490</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Baumgarten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Dec 2006 03:45:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2490</guid>
		<description>I would like to ask Mr. Flint to provide us with some evidence that we are fighting a Holy War.  Even the U.S. government itself does not make this claim as a justification for what we are doing in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.  There was a brief rash of media blather in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 in places like -- dare I say it? -- the "liberal" NY Times that fueled this outrageous notion, but it soon faded, and deservedly so.

Similarly, what evidence is there that Al Qaeda and other terrorists groups are opposing us, and specifically Christians, on religious or ideological grounds?  In fact, there are copious statements by OBL and others to the effect that Israel's occupation of Palestinian lands is their biggest issue (I say this to reflect their portrayal of the issue, not necessarily to signal my agreement with it. Whose land it is may be in dispute, but what is indisputable is that Israel has dispossessed many Palestinians both within and outside its borders); and a close second is the U.S.'s meddling in -- and now outright occupation of -- sovereign Middle Eastern countries.  A little history, please: What country cozied up to Saddam Hussein in the 1980s?  What country installed the Iranian "Shah" in the 1960s?  What country is still buddy-buddy with repressive Arab monarchies such as Saudi Arabia?  What country is even now building dozens of permanent bases in Iraq?

Truly, Mr. Flint has laid bare the very worst in religious hypocrisy.  What good Christians we are at home, giving succor to the poor and needy -- while our good Christian soldiers bravely go to slaughter the heathen hordes of Arabia.  I wonder, would the kind hand of philanthropy be extended to those same Islamic brothers and sisters at home, or would they be turned away as would-be terrorists and turned over to the DHS?  Alternatively, does charity and forgiveness extend only as far as our national borders, and not one inch more?

If one reads through my sometimes faulty sarcasm in the previous messages, one will see that I am saying precisely that many institutions do in fact treat people shabbily, more often than not those most in need.  For goodness sake, our politicians have raised shafting everyone but the rich to a high art.  So, yes, it may be that churches do better than most in helping all in need.  However, I would like to think that equally, in principle at least, our secular institutions do not discriminate on the basis of BELIEFS.  I am not so naive as to think that this is purely true in practice, as I have written on these pages quite recently about the realities of racism, for example.

I am sorry that you find me such a downer on your blog, Terry.  I could actually provide you with a long, long list of things I like.  But I feel that I must speak out on the things I don't like.  I don't like hyporcisy, I don't like chauvinism, and I don't like being the citizen of a country with blood on its -- and my -- hands.  Personally, I'd rather God give us a good long time out instead of any more blessings.

--Fred--</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would like to ask Mr. Flint to provide us with some evidence that we are fighting a Holy War.  Even the U.S. government itself does not make this claim as a justification for what we are doing in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.  There was a brief rash of media blather in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 in places like &#8212; dare I say it? &#8212; the &#8220;liberal&#8221; NY Times that fueled this outrageous notion, but it soon faded, and deservedly so.</p>
<p>Similarly, what evidence is there that Al Qaeda and other terrorists groups are opposing us, and specifically Christians, on religious or ideological grounds?  In fact, there are copious statements by OBL and others to the effect that Israel&#8217;s occupation of Palestinian lands is their biggest issue (I say this to reflect their portrayal of the issue, not necessarily to signal my agreement with it. Whose land it is may be in dispute, but what is indisputable is that Israel has dispossessed many Palestinians both within and outside its borders); and a close second is the U.S.&#8217;s meddling in &#8212; and now outright occupation of &#8212; sovereign Middle Eastern countries.  A little history, please: What country cozied up to Saddam Hussein in the 1980s?  What country installed the Iranian &#8220;Shah&#8221; in the 1960s?  What country is still buddy-buddy with repressive Arab monarchies such as Saudi Arabia?  What country is even now building dozens of permanent bases in Iraq?</p>
<p>Truly, Mr. Flint has laid bare the very worst in religious hypocrisy.  What good Christians we are at home, giving succor to the poor and needy &#8212; while our good Christian soldiers bravely go to slaughter the heathen hordes of Arabia.  I wonder, would the kind hand of philanthropy be extended to those same Islamic brothers and sisters at home, or would they be turned away as would-be terrorists and turned over to the DHS?  Alternatively, does charity and forgiveness extend only as far as our national borders, and not one inch more?</p>
<p>If one reads through my sometimes faulty sarcasm in the previous messages, one will see that I am saying precisely that many institutions do in fact treat people shabbily, more often than not those most in need.  For goodness sake, our politicians have raised shafting everyone but the rich to a high art.  So, yes, it may be that churches do better than most in helping all in need.  However, I would like to think that equally, in principle at least, our secular institutions do not discriminate on the basis of BELIEFS.  I am not so naive as to think that this is purely true in practice, as I have written on these pages quite recently about the realities of racism, for example.</p>
<p>I am sorry that you find me such a downer on your blog, Terry.  I could actually provide you with a long, long list of things I like.  But I feel that I must speak out on the things I don&#8217;t like.  I don&#8217;t like hyporcisy, I don&#8217;t like chauvinism, and I don&#8217;t like being the citizen of a country with blood on its &#8212; and my &#8212; hands.  Personally, I&#8217;d rather God give us a good long time out instead of any more blessings.</p>
<p>&#8211;Fred&#8211;</p>
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		<title>By: Terry</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2489</link>
		<dc:creator>Terry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Dec 2006 03:28:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2489</guid>
		<description>Go get 'em, Mike!

Evidently Fred is soft on any institutions he deems to have good intentions. They are "free of charge," while those he disagrees with come at great cost to society.

Not included in Fred's list of those that â€œhelped mold the very fabric of our nationâ€ are police/firefighters, the military and small business owners. Gee, they all tend to be conservative politically.

But I'm sure Fred didn't mean anything by it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Go get &#8216;em, Mike!</p>
<p>Evidently Fred is soft on any institutions he deems to have good intentions. They are &#8220;free of charge,&#8221; while those he disagrees with come at great cost to society.</p>
<p>Not included in Fred&#8217;s list of those that â€œhelped mold the very fabric of our nationâ€ are police/firefighters, the military and small business owners. Gee, they all tend to be conservative politically.</p>
<p>But I&#8217;m sure Fred didn&#8217;t mean anything by it.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Flint</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2486</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Flint</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Dec 2006 00:51:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2486</guid>
		<description>A few more thoughs, if you please.

I personally believe that all of our involvement with the Middle East and terrorists are rooted in religious differences.  WMD's, territory, human rights and numerous other issues are simply covers for the reality of what is happening in our world.

I believe it is easier for people to deal with the various 'cover issues', than to face the reality that it is (in my eyes)Islam v Christianity.

I felt it necessary to clarify myself on that issue.

Second, the institutions mentioned by Fred are not as readily available to those in need as he may think.  Those in need are not always poor or minority.

There are many 'in need' folks who simply work hard everyday.

I have had personal experience over the last year and one half with how the Hospital and Medical system will put you off or treat you less than human if you do not have medical insurance or the means to pay their overly high charges and do not belong to some special group.

I have yet to find legal services that truly meet the needs of those in need, at least not to any degree of quality.

I could go on, but I choose not to.  I maintain that our Houses of Worship are the only institutions that treat all who come in need equally.

Lastly, where did Fred get the idea that Schools and Unions offered anything for free?  Schools use tax dollars (and I do NOT recall having a choice in paying them), and Unions collect dues, again without choice from the membership.

May God bless our communities and our country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few more thoughs, if you please.</p>
<p>I personally believe that all of our involvement with the Middle East and terrorists are rooted in religious differences.  WMD&#8217;s, territory, human rights and numerous other issues are simply covers for the reality of what is happening in our world.</p>
<p>I believe it is easier for people to deal with the various &#8216;cover issues&#8217;, than to face the reality that it is (in my eyes)Islam v Christianity.</p>
<p>I felt it necessary to clarify myself on that issue.</p>
<p>Second, the institutions mentioned by Fred are not as readily available to those in need as he may think.  Those in need are not always poor or minority.</p>
<p>There are many &#8216;in need&#8217; folks who simply work hard everyday.</p>
<p>I have had personal experience over the last year and one half with how the Hospital and Medical system will put you off or treat you less than human if you do not have medical insurance or the means to pay their overly high charges and do not belong to some special group.</p>
<p>I have yet to find legal services that truly meet the needs of those in need, at least not to any degree of quality.</p>
<p>I could go on, but I choose not to.  I maintain that our Houses of Worship are the only institutions that treat all who come in need equally.</p>
<p>Lastly, where did Fred get the idea that Schools and Unions offered anything for free?  Schools use tax dollars (and I do NOT recall having a choice in paying them), and Unions collect dues, again without choice from the membership.</p>
<p>May God bless our communities and our country.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Baumgarten</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2472</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Baumgarten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Dec 2006 19:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2472</guid>
		<description>Depends on what you mean by "like."

Ha!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Depends on what you mean by &#8220;like.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ha!</p>
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		<title>By: Terry</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2470</link>
		<dc:creator>Terry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:48:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2470</guid>
		<description>Fred,

You're sounding a little like Mikey on the Life cereal commercial from our youth.

This may sound like a petulant question, but I think it bears asking. Is there anything about the current state of the world that you like?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fred,</p>
<p>You&#8217;re sounding a little like Mikey on the Life cereal commercial from our youth.</p>
<p>This may sound like a petulant question, but I think it bears asking. Is there anything about the current state of the world that you like?</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Baumgarten</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2468</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Baumgarten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Dec 2006 17:44:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2468</guid>
		<description>I took Mr. Flint's meaning to be that WE are fighting a religious war, as distinct from being embroiled in a Sunni-Shiite war -- in other words, a war between Islam and...well, I'm not sure what -- so-called "Western values"?  Or are we to believe that this actually a modern-day Crusade between Islam and Christianity?

Of all the spurious reasons given for our invasion of Iraq (WMD, bringing the gift of Democracy, etc.), this has to be the douziest.  Saddam Hussein, as everyone knows, was basically a securalist, and no connection between him and Al-Qaeda has ever been proven.

If you think that Al-Qaeda has engaged the West in a war for religious reasons, think again.  They object to the U.S.'s and its allies' policies in the Middle East, and specifically our (and Israel's) occupation of Middle Eastern countries and intervention in their internal affairs.

Israel/Palestine is not a religious struggle; that is, it is not fought for religious reasons.  It is a struggle for land and the right to exist (on both sides).  To the extent that Israel defines itself as a Jewish state, people often mistake it for a religious battle, but that is mistaken.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I took Mr. Flint&#8217;s meaning to be that WE are fighting a religious war, as distinct from being embroiled in a Sunni-Shiite war &#8212; in other words, a war between Islam and&#8230;well, I&#8217;m not sure what &#8212; so-called &#8220;Western values&#8221;?  Or are we to believe that this actually a modern-day Crusade between Islam and Christianity?</p>
<p>Of all the spurious reasons given for our invasion of Iraq (WMD, bringing the gift of Democracy, etc.), this has to be the douziest.  Saddam Hussein, as everyone knows, was basically a securalist, and no connection between him and Al-Qaeda has ever been proven.</p>
<p>If you think that Al-Qaeda has engaged the West in a war for religious reasons, think again.  They object to the U.S.&#8217;s and its allies&#8217; policies in the Middle East, and specifically our (and Israel&#8217;s) occupation of Middle Eastern countries and intervention in their internal affairs.</p>
<p>Israel/Palestine is not a religious struggle; that is, it is not fought for religious reasons.  It is a struggle for land and the right to exist (on both sides).  To the extent that Israel defines itself as a Jewish state, people often mistake it for a religious battle, but that is mistaken.</p>
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		<title>By: Yankee</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2462</link>
		<dc:creator>Yankee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:41:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2462</guid>
		<description>When my public, elementary school in another small town in CT burned down in the mid-1960's, classes for fifth and sixth graders were moved for the next two years to a Jewish temple in an adjoining town. I do not recall any complaints about violations of church-and state. People were simply glad to have a place for their children to continue their studies. How times have changed. And not for the better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When my public, elementary school in another small town in CT burned down in the mid-1960&#8217;s, classes for fifth and sixth graders were moved for the next two years to a Jewish temple in an adjoining town. I do not recall any complaints about violations of church-and state. People were simply glad to have a place for their children to continue their studies. How times have changed. And not for the better.</p>
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		<title>By: Terry</title>
		<link>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2458</link>
		<dc:creator>Terry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Dec 2006 14:28:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://tcextra.com/terrycowgill/2006/12/13/wednesdays-thoughts/#comment-2458</guid>
		<description>Good point, Steve. Or perhaps they should tackle "In God We Trust" on our currency or the practice of Congress beginning each day's session with a prayer. Either of those would make an interesting SCOTUS test.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good point, Steve. Or perhaps they should tackle &#8220;In God We Trust&#8221; on our currency or the practice of Congress beginning each day&#8217;s session with a prayer. Either of those would make an interesting SCOTUS test.</p>
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